Utah County Republican Party Central Committee Meeting
21 Feb 2009
Provo City Council Chambers
NOTE: This is a typed record of a meeting, not an actual transcript. I did my best to capture the intent when I couldn't get the exact words. I may have gotten a few things wrong, so don't take everything in here as a 100% pure representation. Hopefully it will still be useful in providing an overview of what came up and what was said on the topics presented. Assume quality goes down as the document progresses. In several cases there was expansion dialogue that I didn't try to keep up with, instead typing only the main points, so there isn't as much depth recorded here. There was also some quick discussion back and forth a few times that I didn't bother trying to keep up with.
Q&A segments.
Q: indicates person and/or people asking the question.
A: Indicates one of the legislators responding to the question.
Sometimes there are some back-and-forth comments & discussion.
(My comments are in parenthesis.)
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Executive Session
8:38 AM Start
3 bylaw proposals
Platform revision procedures – so far votes have been unanimous
No discussion, passed unanimously
Bylaw 5 revision – 1 dissenting vote in committee (wanted to see some things different, but those wouldn't change the intent of the revision anyway, and those can also be added later).
Concern from Lisa Shepherd.
No discussion, passed with 1 dissenting vote
General Session – 9:07 AM Start
Jason Chaffetz – Honor & privilege. I got a little emotional in front of state legislature. Abraham Lincoln. 2 ½ hrs before, the President had read something about Abraham Lincoln.
It's not every week you can go out and cast a vote “no” on a trillion dollar spending package. That bill was legislative malpractice. It passed out at 11:00pm. They didn't even have time to number the pages. There's no way to decipher that. It passed unanimously that we would let every bill have ?? hours in the light of day before voting. Government is going to spend nearly 40% of our GDP. Obama reversed the Mexico City policy, so now we are funding abortions in other countries. Obama promised transparency and we get tax cheats. The President promised he would go line by line and remove pork. (Rundown of spending that doesn't belong in the bill.) I went to the Pentagon. I met with the Secretary of Defense and the Joint Chiefs. The Secretary of Defense said “You know what keeps me up at night? The Chinese with $1 trillion in treasury notes, because there's nothing we can do about that.” If you're ever in DC, please stop by. Please communicate and contact us.
Marian Monahan – Motion to allow 2 minutes, 3 people for/3 people against, speak once only. Passed.
3 proposals, one withdrawn (Withdrawn: the one regarding speaking times at convention)
1)Platform revision procedures
2)Bylaw 5 revisions
3)Revision to education officer
Platform Revision Procedures
Currently – every 2 years before organizing convention. Any central committee member can attend and propose.
238 Precinct Chairs & Vice Chairs (Half to 2/3 actually attend the convention)
Motion to postpone – failed 79/81 – revote: failed 78/85
Role of Legislative Chair and Education Officer is to educate chairs and vice chairs
Proposed amendment is that the final provision would allow ratification at convention. This would allow an up or down vote, as currently done.
Change to include delegates with central committee members as people allowed to propose changes – failed.
Argument for: We should include more people in the process.
Argument against: The party is a representative republic system, much like our government. If people want to propose changes, they can approach their precinct chairs and vice chairs to get them submitted.
Proposed change to have a ratifying vote at convention – passed.
Proposed revision passed.
Bylaw 5 – Postponed until next meeting.
Election of Education Officer – Postponed until next meeting.
This portion of meeting adjourned – 10:13am
Legislators Discussion
Rep. John Dougall, House District 27
The economy is shrinking. We need to tighten our belts in government. We need to look at what we're doing and trim the budget. We need to make sure government is doing the limited scope we expect it to do.
Senator Mark Madsen, Senate District 13
Utah County Republican Caucus chair
Rep. Stephen Sandstrom, House District 58
Update on a few issues. I tend to pick more conservative and controversial issues.
Too often government grows too fast. We're looking at programs enacted 2-3 years ago. Now, trying to cut them, it's the end of the world. Government grew too fast. It grew by $600,000. Imagine if we instead didn't spend that money and get people hooked on government programs. I sat on the Health and Human Services committee with Representative Brad Daw. We hold the conservative position on that committee. I motioned to table the gay adoption bill. Brad Daw assisted with that.
Illegal immigration – Sponsoring a bill that will require professional/business license applicants to prove citizenship. Curt Bramble is the Senate sponsor.
Illegal Immigration – Help from Senator Dayton. Proposing a bill to have Utah opt out of the REAL ID act. REAL ID is nothing more than laying the framework for tyranny in this country. Say that and the papers paint you as a radical. We're looking at an RFID chip in your driver's license. 21 other states have opted out already. We have an ally in the Obama administration – Janet Napolitano, former Governor of Arizona.
There is also a resolution to assert our 10th Amendment rights as a state. Let us decide where we drill in our state. There is a bill to allow law-abiding Utah citizens to carry concealed loaded firearms in their car (HB 357). Bad guys are doing it anyway. Let citizens do it. (Some questions from the floor.)
HJR8 to protect secret ballot for unionizing. Needs a 2/3 vote.
Rep. Patrick Painter, House District 67
Common Ground issues. We had one in labor – HB 267, an anti-discrimination bill. We killed it in committee. It failed 10-4.
With respect to leases in Carbon & Duchesne Counties. Open the drilling fields. There are roughly 1500 gas wells. We got stiffed on that one. We assumed $100 million in annual revenues.
Another energy item – sponsored resolution endorsing use of coal. Passed unanimously.
Water rights – follow up from last year's HB51 – State engineer will not forfeit water rights. Also, State Engineer “shall” approve an extension, changed from “may” approve.
Rep. Michael Morley, House District 66
This has certainly been a budget year. I certainly endorse the comments made so far. The committee has a position against raising fees as a way to increase the general fund. We're philosophically opposed to raising fees under the pretense of supporting an activity. This results in an effective tax increase.
Sponsoring bills – one is an action bill intended to eliminate frivolous lawsuits by people who move next to farms then complain about the smell.
Also a bill regarding children and vulnerable adults exposed to drugs. We're working on the definition of exposure.
We're trying to put some kind of teeth into a statute regarding mature video games. Some games promote rampant promiscuity, murdering prostitutes, cop killing, etc. We have found a Constitutional way to address them.
Rep. Kerry Gibson, House District 6
This is my first term. I'm on the judiciary standing committee. Also business and labor, appropriations, public education. No earth-shaking bills. This has been an interesting process. Health care is my background. I administer a surgical center. I'm looking for education from my colleagues in areas that are not my expertise. My policy is that when you speak, make sure it's quality speak and not just to hear yourself speak.
Rep. Lorie Fowlke, House District 59
A citizen legislature is so much better than a full-time legislature.
There is frustration with the stopping of sales of energy leases on our ground.
HJR8 – Secret Ballots. I get contacted by a lot of individuals because they want to protect the secret ballot, but have confused what the ballot will do. They ask me to vote against it to support secret ballots. We already have a right to a secret ballot, but is not clear that it reflects union votes, too. If we clarify the Constitution, it will be harder for federal preemption of the Utah Constitution than if it is just a state statute.
Common Ground. This issue will not go away. They are very organized, very smart. Very aggressive attacks on our families. This democracy will only work with a moral people. The whole idea of winning is in framing the argument the right way. There are five bills – same-sex adoption, housing discrimination, unemployment discrimination, (?)… You can be fired for being gay, yes, but also for having green hair. There is at-will employment in Utah. What they are asking for is exceptional rights and being included in a special group.
Rep. Brad Daw, House District 60
Health care reform committee. Health care in this country is not market driven. It is not market based. We have so many restrictions – Medicare, Medicaid, HIPAA. One of the major initiatives we have is to put individuals back in charge. It allows employers to put money in a portal, and employees can decide where the money goes. When you change jobs, as long as both employers use the same portal, you don't lose benefits. Consumerism works, we just need to give it an honest try in the state. Most of the detractors are the large insurance companies. They say that people don't need to decide their method of financing, but only to control costs. Price fixing and denial of service are not market solutions.
Rep. Steve Clark, House District 63
Primary responsibility – Co-chair of capital facilities. We approve all land purchases in Utah, and construction. UVU needs land to grow. We have two projects that we think we can get constructed. 1) Mountainlands project at Thanksgiving point. 2) Science building at UVU. We're working with executive appropriations to move forward with bonding. Rates are at an all time low, construction costs are at an all-time low. If we did all the projects on our list, we could probably build one whole building with the savings from all of those projects. We're pushing very aggressively to get done those things we need to get done right now. We can get a very low price with our AAA bond rating.
Rep. Becky Lockhart, House District 64
Revenues are down another $320 million. Approaching in the 2010 year, $750 million in reductions.
In terms of health care reform, one thing important is a concept called “mandate light.” It says that insurance companies do not have to offer everything to everyone. Federal and state mandates increase the cost. This allows people to pick and choose what they want. Be aware that there are consequences as a consumer for not choosing coverage.
Lori (Fowlke) is very intelligent on the Common Ground initiatives. She has done her due diligence on this issue. She knows the agenda and the tactics. She has read all of the court cases.
Regarding the $320 million of ongoing reductions. As an entire Republican caucus we will be discussing what to do about these reductions. We've done the research, we have the charts & graphs. Some people believe that raising taxes is the only way out of this. There are also those opposed. Some are in between. It takes 38 in the House, 15 in the Senate & the Governor to get anything done. I expect that we will pass the budget at 11:50 on the last night. That happens when we have a lot of money.
Q: Energy Solutions proposal?
A: Defer that one to the senators.
Q: Impact of increasing cigarette tax?
A: That's still on the table. You can increase it a penny or $3. The fiscal impact is anywhere in there. It was tabled in Senate, indicating they are not interested in that tax. All of the “revenue enhancements,” there are several that will be laid out on the table because people are advocating them. To dismiss any of them out of hand without discussion would be irresponsible. What will happen in the final budget has yet to be determined.
Q: I'm a health care provider. It got my attention when you said we're really looking at alcohol. The state makes $100 million profit on alcohol sales. How much of that is spent to help people prevent substance abuse? A very small amount. I give you high marks for your work getting rid of alco-pops. Please work to help people to recover or avoid addictions.
A: It's interesting when we talk about “sin taxes”. We tax things we think are bad, then we fund programs with that revenue stream. We send a mixed message to stop doing it because we don't like it, but we also don't want them to stop because we want the revenue stream. It's hypocritical.
Q: A question on the leadership role in the House. Is there any word on Speaker Curtis and his rapid jump to the lobby? Any ethical questions?
A: There's nothing illegal about what he has done. I would say there is nothing unethical about it. It's fine to be employed as soon as you leave the House. There's a bill on the floor to prohibit legislators from being a paid lobbying contractor for one year after leaving the House. Every cycle, there are some who leave service and end up being a lobbyist; most are not successful.
A: As it happened last week, Curtis lobbied for a position. He did not prevail.
Rep. Keith Grover, House District 61
Common Ground initiative. I received over 250 emails, about half on each side. I imagine you'll see this in every session, probably indefinitely. Continue to contact your Representatives. Some Representatives have not been hearing from constituents. When I voted against it, I was called (lists a string of epithets). I invite all of you to continue to be involved in the process.
There is a proposal that allows professionals to be teachers.
Another is the gang initiative sponsored by Senator Griner. I work at Orem Junior High. Police intervened in a gang event. The intervening took care of it. A couple days later, I was doing a patrol. I saw a couple kids across the street (something about a confrontation or incident earlier in the day). I am prohibited from crossing the street to bring them back. The police could not respond because they weren't actively doing something.
Rep. Kenneth Sumsion, House District 56
One bill is an abortion litigation trust fund. It will allow private individuals to contribute to a fund to help the state defend itself against lawsuits arising from anti-abortion legislation. This is probably our last shot at this under the current administration. This is an opportunity as citizens to vote with their pocketbooks.
There is a multi-billion dollar bridge building company interested in building a toll bridge across Utah Lake. (Mention of locations.) It would be a very nice bridge. They built the bridge that replaced the one that collapsed in Minneapolis.
Bill calling for greater transparency in all levels of government.
Bill requiring sex offenders to register with local police department instead of state agency when off parole.
Downturns are what makes America great. It makes our businesses better. It gets rid of the dead wood. We're screwing that up at the federal level by bailing them out.
Q: GRAMA request vs. transparency?
Rep. John Dougall, House District 27
I tried to amend the bill on the floor. We raised the bar too high. Higher than it needs to be on behalf of the Attorney General. There was an appropriate reason to raise the bar, but in this case we raised it too far.
Q: HB 122.
A: It's interesting that media is clamoring for free access to information, yet claims protection from being able to allow a court to review the entire tape from which a segment was shown on the air.
A: We are trying to protect people who might have their due process endangered. We're creating a review layer. The presumption is that they document will be released, but there is a check to make sure nothing bad will happen to the individual on whom the information is being released.
Q: The DNA of fetus is not the same as that of mother. Has anyone considered using that argument against the “it's my body” argument?
A: (Discussion of the Dakotas with “personhood” legislation.)
Rep. Craig Frank, House District 57
How to get an email answered: put your name and precinct in the subject line. If you want to follow along during the session, go to http://le.utah.gov/
Craig Frank's blog - http://underthedome.org/
Recommend Holly's blog - http://hollyonthehill.wordpress.com/
I have a suggestion on the sin taxes. Perhaps if we taxed cold caffeine we'd solve the problems.
I'm carrying a resolution on the stimulus package. It will be heard Monday morning, in House Government Operations. It starts at 8:30am. We're not sitting back as a state. We're expressing our dismay to DC.
I'm the Chair of Government Operations. We had a marriage license fee increase, proposed by Rep. Johnson (House District 25). We concluded a $10 increase in the marriage license did not correlate with domestic abuse.
Privatization is a big issue. We're trying to throttle back government. If you can find a product or service in the yellow pages, we certainly shouldn't be producing that as a government. We need to focus on the smaller, more manageable role of government. Land owners at the top of Utah Lake are concerned about imminent domain and condemnation. We recognize the importance of roads, but also the importance of individual rights. We also need to give proper amounts of money for that land.
Rep. Chris Herrod, House District 62
Even though I'm a fiscal conservative, it is no fun to cut budgets and affect people's lives. Even though it's no fun, sometimes it's the right thing to do. We have to be careful. Bonding is something we have, but we have to be careful with bonding.
On the Common Ground initiatives we here agree, but there are some people in the state who are wavering.
I do have a number of bills. DUI. Choose Life license plate, and the funding would go towards adoption agencies.
Federal byways. Once you start taking federal money there are strings attached.
(House members excused for meeting with UDOT – 12:00 PM)
Sen. Margaret Dayton, Senate District 13
I am in awe of all of you for being caring enough to be here and for being interested in the legislative process. We do have great House members. I'm grateful to be serving with these wonderful people.
Ran a bill to promote hunting. (Something about it being an alternative to deer birth control to control populations.)
Something about bank access.
A bill the makes people responsible for leaving a campfire that goes out of control.
A concurrent enrollment bill to keep option open for students.
Sen. David Hinkins, Senate District 27
(Personal history.)
$65 million gas line from Green River to Utah Valley. It's an expensive pipeline that will not get money because of RMPs that have been pulled. It's a big impact when the cost goes from $16mil to $32mil. Don't think that laying off thousands of coal miners won't impact you (or something like that).
I'm running a controversial bill to allow nuclear power in Utah. Hopefully it will give them something else to chase besides coal!
Q: The federal government controls 7-8% of the state. Is there any way to get them to relinquish control?
A: We should have the same rights as the original 13 colonies.
Sen. Curt Bramble, Senate District 16
There's language in a bill that makes it a 2nd degree felony if anyone performs an illegal abortion. Some opposition claimed that the new language would force lawsuits. The language complies with Roe v. Wade and Supreme Court decisions.
There's a bill to remove the statute of limitations for restitution. Currently a criminal can avoid restitution by dancing around the issue long enough.
There's a bill to force the Utah Supreme Court to follow state statute on appeals. (The Utah Supreme Court has pretty much just decided they're not going to allow any executions on death row because they don't like them.)
We were asked to address low-level waste. Energy Solutions is prohibited from taking any but the lowest level of radioactive waste. (Note that this is not nuclear waste, which is a subset of radioactive waste.) Only A waste can come in currently. 99.9% of that waste comes from outside Utah. The proposal is to take 5% of the remaining available space to take the same type of waste from outside the country. It would generate about $1.5 billion over the next 10 years. The Governor said he is opposed to it without even looking at it, Jim Matheson is also opposed without even looking at it. Personally, if this waste is not generated in the state, it's the same waste.
Autism – your heart goes out to families that have an autistic child, but to impose a mandate on the private insurance companies is not the right way to go. Making the insurance offer a rider would not be the same as mandating coverage. It would be $120 per year if added before the birth of the child.
Raising the cigarette tax. It would reduce revenue & increase smuggling. That is why we oppose increasing the tax.
Q: Please start giving examples of what class A radioactive waste is.
A: When you get an X-ray, it produces low-level radioactive waste.
(Lots of discussion back and forth.)
Sen. Mark Madsen, Senate District 13
The reaction is often to make cuts that cause the greatest amount of pain downstream to preserve the bureaucracy. We propose that at least 65% of education money should be spent in the classroom.
Cigarette tax discussion. From the position that alcohol is a drug, that makes the state the largest drug dealer in the state.
Common Ground. It's amazing to see the hatred and vitriol that spews from homosexual activists. The double standard in the media is astounding.
Q: SCR1. It seeks a state guest worker program. Why did you vote for it?
A: Madsen. I voted for it on the second reading, which was the original form. I wanted to get on the conference committee. Were able to make some changes in conference committee, but I was not satisfied with final reading, so I voted against it.
A: Bramble. Currently the federal government will not enforce immigration law, and has also been ruling against the states, claiming federal preemption. I wasn't happy with a lot that was in the bill, but I would have voted for it because of the strong message it would have sent to Washington. We're tired of them not doing anything, and not letting us do anything.
Q: Ethics reform? It seems that it would be in your best interest to make clear rules and standards where ethics could be addressed. My understanding is that the only ethical rule is to disclose any conflict of interest on paper. There is no opportunity to recuse yourself from a vote. The latest media reports are that ethics reform is being slowed down.
A: Bramble. There are two approaches. When you elect a legislator, they are private individuals. They all have careers and everyone will be faced with a conflict at some point. Forcing everyone to vote on every bill levels the playing field. It's not possible to lock down every situation. We can't define “direct financial interest” and the media would have you believe we're dragging our feet or fighting against it. (Some examples of situations that would cause problems through no fault of the individual. There are too many situations, and as soon as you miss one by mistake that someone else thinks you should have caught...)
The Daily Herald has become the sole legitimate voice in Utah County. The Salt Lake media is ridiculous.
Thank you all for coming.
12:55 PM - End
